Big end failure, det or oil surge? (long post)
From my experience there are two kinds of Subaru specialist but I doubt it's exclusively a Subaru thing. There are those who will give you an honest estimate of how long it will take to do the work and those who will give you a timescale you want to hear then, once your car's in bits, will give all the reasons why that deadline can't be met. You then end up with a job that's taken as long, or longer, than your preferred builder.
Gerry, I've done 2 trackdays this year, getting most of the way through the 2nd before it went pop. Mind you, I've done only about 4k road miles in it as well. Most of this year has been spent dicking around with the damn thing not driving it.
Was much happier when I just did suspension and brakes on my old '95 and thrashed it up to 130k miles without incident. Would feel slow getting back into it now tho...
Was much happier when I just did suspension and brakes on my old '95 and thrashed it up to 130k miles without incident. Would feel slow getting back into it now tho...
Andy916 wrote:Gerry, I've done 2 trackdays this year, getting most of the way through the 2nd before it went pop. Mind you, I've done only about 4k road miles in it as well. Most of this year has been spent dicking around with the damn thing not driving it.
Was much happier when I just did suspension and brakes on my old '95 and thrashed it up to 130k miles without incident. Would feel slow getting back into it now tho...
It's the 2 track days that you're preparing the car for not the road use. Or in your case, one track day and a half
Look at your two sentences:
Firstly, you haven't done two track days because it went pop at the second one. You've been dicking around by playing at preparing a track car but it was only a half hearted attempt.
You WERE much happier in your old car but you've moved on and wouldn't be happy with it now so something of a wasted statement. Slower is safer but you don't want slow.
I'm not trying to have a go at you but if you're trying to build a Porsche busting track devil, you've got to fit the right bits or your next engine will go pop just the same, forged or not, fuel surge and oil surge will kill it.
Don't take a wallnut to crack a sledgehammer
If i'd listened to advice like this 18 months ago rather than sourcing the fastest available components i wouldn't be on my 3rd engine now! (and seriously out of pocket)Gerry H wrote:
I'm not trying to have a go at you but if you're trying to build a Porsche busting track devil, you've got to fit the right bits or your next engine will go pop just the same, forged or not, fuel surge and oil surge will kill it.
Whatever route you take Andy, I genuinely hope you get it sorted.
Tony - aye, I'll have a word with Gary.
Gerry - with this car, I've backed away from the track devil thing. Ohlins standard-pattern struts have replaced uncompromising coilovers, plus various other things with road rather than track in mind. Yes, I did a couple, but it's the nature of Gerrards at Mallory that bit me, rather than it being under-prepared. Cosworth baffle plate was fitted, whilst waiting for the full baffled sump to be sorted by its fabricator. On road tyres I didn't think I'd have a problem basically, having run much stickier on an Impreza at different circuits.
Gerry - with this car, I've backed away from the track devil thing. Ohlins standard-pattern struts have replaced uncompromising coilovers, plus various other things with road rather than track in mind. Yes, I did a couple, but it's the nature of Gerrards at Mallory that bit me, rather than it being under-prepared. Cosworth baffle plate was fitted, whilst waiting for the full baffled sump to be sorted by its fabricator. On road tyres I didn't think I'd have a problem basically, having run much stickier on an Impreza at different circuits.
But they arent ordinary low grip road tyres really ...
A baffled sump is a necessity if you start to go quick (which you are) up until the point that the baffled sump cant cope and dry sump is the only solution.
An Oil Cooler is also a necessity and keeping the oil in pristine condition.
Uprating the rod and pistons - why ? when these have not failed (although one or more rods may well be scrap now).
Fuel surge can be cured without encroaching on road car useage by fitting the swirl pot in the engine bay like I have or beneath the rear of the car with an additional pump there. (Zen have done lots of installs like that for road/track cars). Well worth it as you will get fuel surge at around 1/2 tank otherwise, which despite being annoying can be very destructive.
A second hand STi 7/8 short block can be cheap and would make a good budget rebuild.
But it depends on the ultimate objectives for the car.
A baffled sump is a necessity if you start to go quick (which you are) up until the point that the baffled sump cant cope and dry sump is the only solution.
An Oil Cooler is also a necessity and keeping the oil in pristine condition.
Uprating the rod and pistons - why ? when these have not failed (although one or more rods may well be scrap now).
Fuel surge can be cured without encroaching on road car useage by fitting the swirl pot in the engine bay like I have or beneath the rear of the car with an additional pump there. (Zen have done lots of installs like that for road/track cars). Well worth it as you will get fuel surge at around 1/2 tank otherwise, which despite being annoying can be very destructive.
A second hand STi 7/8 short block can be cheap and would make a good budget rebuild.
But it depends on the ultimate objectives for the car.
On objectives I still want to do the 'ring in this car, and probably the occasional trackday still, so the baffled sump will be going on, oil cooler (and 11mm oil pump to maintain pressure with the cooler) and fuel surge protection of some sort. Not keen on under bonnet for the latter tbh - it's yet another possibility for fire and the heat won't be ideal.duncan wrote:But they arent ordinary low grip road tyres really ...
A baffled sump is a necessity if you start to go quick (which you are) up until the point that the baffled sump cant cope and dry sump is the only solution.
An Oil Cooler is also a necessity and keeping the oil in pristine condition.
Uprating the rod and pistons - why ? when these have not failed (although one or more rods may well be scrap now).
Fuel surge can be cured without encroaching on road car useage by fitting the swirl pot in the engine bay like I have or beneath the rear of the car with an additional pump there. (Zen have done lots of installs like that for road/track cars). Well worth it as you will get fuel surge at around 1/2 tank otherwise, which despite being annoying can be very destructive.
A second hand STi 7/8 short block can be cheap and would make a good budget rebuild.
But it depends on the ultimate objectives for the car.
As an aside I'm pretty sure I pulled greater cornering forces on my old car which had no sump baffling. I ran slicks briefly at Marham and Snetterton and remember being stuck solid to my line behind Gerry sliding around on 888s (or A048s, I forget). Corner duration wasn't as long as Gerrards though.
Talking to Mark at Lateral, the STi6 pistons are 'pretty good' and might be retained. The rods aren't so strong and, as you say, some damage is likely anyway.
Talking to my brother last night, he just spent about double what I'm about to spend on his TVR (Rover) V8 rebuild. Puts things into context a bit! That 6 grand does include a 4.6 conversion and uprated heads, net result is just 300bhp/320lbft but starts at half the revs of a scoob. Cause was an overheating problem, road not track, melting stuff deep down in the camshaft area. Keep an eye on your temp gauge Gerry...
Andy916 wrote:
Talking to my brother last night, he just spent about double what I'm about to spend on his TVR (Rover) V8 rebuild. Puts things into context a bit! That 6 grand does include a 4.6 conversion and uprated heads, net result is just 300bhp/320lbft but starts at half the revs of a scoob. Cause was an overheating problem, road not track, melting stuff deep down in the camshaft area. Keep an eye on your temp gauge Gerry...
I didn't really need to know that Andy.
Temps high but the oil pressure is low just to make up for it.