Project GTR (zed replacement)

[Stuart]

Lovely photos but agreed that a rear wheel lift is unlikely on a GTR. Looks like you guys had far better weather on the Sunday than the MLR lot on the Saturday

[Monster]

yeah it was absolutely great weather. The MLR guys had literally monsoon conditions according to Darrin.

Agreed on the rear wheel but it does look like it in the pic

[Monster]

Managed to get the GTR to Silverstone on Dec 7th with the GTROC, stayed up the night before and had a few beers too which makes a pleasant change. Was pissing with rain most of the day but was great fun. Car behaved bar blowing off a boost pipe (easily forgiven).

It did highlight how shite it is in the wet. The car just won't stop which I assume is the very stiff front end preventing any dive which makes lock up point impossible to predict and very difficult to do anything about once it's locked. It was also understeering a fair bit which was frustrating - once it was sliding it was possible to really power through the corners with armfuls of lock on in trad GTR fashion but there was such little front grip I was struggling to get it sideways early enough, perhaps I ought to learn to Scandinavian flick it

I tried various suspension settings, skylab 4wd settings and tyre pressures but to no real benefit. I guess that's just the price you pay for 1000lb springs and Pilot Sport cups in the pouring rain and 0 degrees December weather

I grabbed a pax ride in a very well driven R32 with softer suspension, Khumo's KU36 tyres (not particularly track biased, still running ABS etc. It's 480bhp at the hubs and Sam is a great driver but I was amaxed how much more bite and braking it had in the wet.

Still, we had a brilliant day just chasing each other and going sideways.

Here's a Video from Sams car - I come into view at about 5 mins but the first bit is worth a watch for some good wheel twirling and R35 baiting

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qw0eMbYx-UY

[Monster]

NB, that vid was later in the day when we started getting a dry line, in the morning I couldn't keep up with video car well, I could just about, right up to the point I locked up and span....

[Fast Eddy]

Watched the vid. Well done guys

[jap.slapper]

Nice video

You can see the benefit of the million and one bits of sensor data working overtime on the white R35 as it goes through the bends and though it still got a bit twitchy at times it didn't look half as much fun as your old R32's.

Was your mates car still running with HICAS?

[Monster]

it was interesting actually. One of the GTROC guys has got a 700bhp R33, stripped and caged like mine which he's had for years, does TDs and sprints in it etc. He''s recently got a stage 4 R35 and took both to Silverstone and said what everyone has always said about skylines that the r35 "did everything for him". he wouldn't stop going on about how easy it was, that braked and steered for him and he could have a cup of tea So it was good to get a perspective from an owner of both and he thought his 33 was much harder work and more fun. That said, they clearly don't do it all, just a different way of driving and they were going pretty well in the conditions I have to say

Not sure if Sam still has hicas on his car, good question, I'll ask him

[jap.slapper]

A thought occurred to me whilst I was on my way back from the school run this morning, have you compared lap times with the AWD fully disabled on your GTR? I would presume the AWD system, despite it being 20 odd years old, would still be working as it should though I'm no expert on it obviously.

The thought stemmed from a feature I read recently in the Feb '09 edition of Jap Performance mag where they conducted a comparison of the owners modded 'R' reg (450bhp) R33 GTR and the owners second car, an '07 plate (stock) R35 GTR. In it they highlighted that the R35 was the same as all GTR's with regards to it being predominantly RWD until the sensors detected things slipping/getting lairy at which point the AWD system kicked in.

The test was conducted on wet/leafy roads through various twists and turns but they didn't report the same tail happiness that was seen in the above video; and I presume that there wouldn't be too much difference between the R32 and R33 AWD systems?

I was wondering if both yours and your mates GTR AWD systems were both showing signs of old age as (your mates in particular) seemed to consistently to be a case of 'through the bends....rear slip-slip-slip-slip-bite' (if that even makes sense?)

I could just be talking complete bollocks due to the fact that I have very little knowledge on how the R32 GTR AWD system does work or should work when operating at 100% effectiveness though I would be interested to see how yours handles in similar conditions when you know 100% that the AWD system has been disabled and then compare the two.

[Stuart]

Another consideration is that you're comparing an 80's or 90's spec Skyline with little or no NVH control when stripped to a 21st century GTR that is fully bedecked with luxury and padding. Hardly like for like......all of the senses are receiving more stimuli in a car with less dampening, so it must 'feel' more raw and involving.

The point Pez makes about the AWD system is spot on and it also may be worth thinking about what diffs the cars are running too. I seem to remember that the Monster R32 has something a bit trick in it but cannot remember whether it's both ends that are upgraded or just one of them?

All interesting stuff though and great to see an R32 that's still being used properly in terms of driving & development (driver and car).

[Monster]

it is an interesting thought and I suppose it's impossible to say if it's working 100%. However there's no reason it shouldn't be. The system works in RWD until it senses the need for 4wd then feeds in as much drive to the front as it thinks it needs.

The 4wd does engage correctly and the needle shows how much is going to the front. I also replaced the G Sensors with the new Electronic skylab unit which processes data hundreds of times faster than the stock old unit (which do tend to deteriorate anyway) so if anything mine should work better than it did originally as it's much more responsive.

I also have a very tight aftermarket rear diff which does make it much more tail happy, front diff is stock. Sam also has a tight aftermarket diff in his car.

The other element you need to consider when watching the vids is driving style. Both Sam and I were very much making the most of the wet conditions and deliberately sliding about. Him more so than I as he was deliberately drifting while I was trying to get the car adopting an angle in order to drive around the understeer. Sideways is also a bit of a default cornering style of the GTR, certainly 32-34 vintage anyway.

All good fun